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Wales not suitable for oil and gas shore base

Dear Editor,

This is in response to your front page report of Bharrat Jagdeo’s announcement that Wales Estate will be converted into a shore base for gas and oil  `Gas-to-shore facility for former Wales estate – Jagdeo’  (SN Jan 1, 2021). That could be a disaster in the making of a magnitude many times greater than Skeldon. Wales is not suitable for an oil and gas industry base. It poses safety and environmental issues. There is potential for major fires from gas lines that could be cut by vessels. The environmental impact of such a project is enormous to take the risk.

Wales is too far in the river from the shore for a base that would be efficient for movement of goods and equipment to and from offshore production oil sites. And it poses great risks to life in the area. Such a base would also disrupt activities from the coastline on both banks up the river way past Wales. It will destroy flora and fauna in the area. A shore base or gas and power generating should be stationed away from high density population centres.

One recalls that Jagdeo went hurriedly into transforming the Skeldon estate that cost the country in excess of US$145M. That factory is now a white elephant and we are still paying the bills for it. The costs associated with that factory would never be recovered. The talk is government plans to give it to Dubai that has no interest in producing sugar. So sugar workers will once again be left in the cold as happened when the factory was built.

Wales will cost in excess of US$600M to be transformed into a shore base. That would be a huge debt that would take decades to be repaid. And it may turn out to be another White elephant. The construction and operation phase would disrupt traffic in the area affecting other economic activities. The proposed overhead bridge would impact on economic life and movement near the Demerara Harbour Bridge. Ships could run into the base of the overhead bridge – a serious threat to the new overhead bridge expected in three years. Increased ship traffic poses serious risks of major accidents. Vessels would pass under the new Demerara bridge construction and both projects would compete for vessel space as construction commences in a year affecting other sectors of the economy, such as the fishing, mining, forestry and bauxite industries.

Building a shore to gas base in Wales would add to the traffic congestion in the river and in the small village. The fishing industry would be severely affected. If there was any spillage or fire in the area, then the fishing industry would be devastated, closed down. Also, increased movement of marine traffic poses a threat to the submersed communication cable line (phone, internet, etc.) and power line under the river. West Demerara and the city are connected by the power grid. On several occasions, the power line was severed by ships resulting in perennial blackouts. The telecom cable was also cut several times over the last couple of decades. Increased traffic at Wales would lead to more cuts of the cable and disruption of telecom service for people on the West Bank all the way to Parika and beyond.

Soil experts tell me that the Demerara River is a fault line in the earth’s crust – the latching layers of soil and rocks on both sides of the river are significantly different. The clay is of different quality on both sides of the river. It is very unstable to pass a gas line in such soil condition. The soil is very weak, unsuitable for heavy construction for a heavy project of a gas base nature. The weakness of the soil is well observed in the construction of the GPL station at Vreed-en-Hoop. The power station suffered significant cost overruns in foundation works.

Some other form of economic activity is needed to create employment and economic activities at Wales. This hair-brained idea of a shore base is ill-conceived. It will not create employment for the people of the area as they lack skills in the technical aspects of construction and operation of a shore base. Instead of a shore base, government can give land to the former estate workers to grow cash crops. 

Wales is not anyone’s personal land. The government should give the land to the workers. The land must be distributed to the people of the area who worked at Wales. A plan could be developed to guide them into farming and other economic activities. Let them develop the land into appropriate cash crop farming. These private farmers will help to provide the growing demand for food. Government can provide them grants and or soft loans to get started and offer subsidies for cultivation over a fixed period of time especially if they are affected by natural calamities. It would cost the government just a small amount of money, not even one hundredth of the cost of a shore base. And the private farmers would be far more productive than a shore base. Any shore base should be constructed closer to the coast – East Coast, West Coast, Essequibo Coast, Berbice Coast, not on the banks of rivers with human habitat and rich flora and fauna.

I urge the government to rethink this idea of a shore to base gas industry at Wales.

Yours faithfully,

(Name and address provided)

Replies sorted oldest to newest

The writer don't seems to know the geographic location of Wales. Wales Estate is right along the bank if the Demerara River,it is approximately 6 miles from the mouth of the River. The Demerara River is already known as a deep water channel, large ships used to ply along to the bauxite Town Linden.

The socioeconomic benefits far out weighs the negatives, it is about creating employment to the West and East Banks communities, Wales and Grove which were battered by the previous administration.

Demerara is the middle county closer for large marine vessels to travel to North America and through the Panama canal to Asia and Europe. Exxon will also be involved, they may use as a storage base, while Guyana will use for holding for marketing purpose.

K

The writer seys Demerara River is too busy. There are other regions in Guyana, that is what I say. Recently the marine cable was busted in Demerara river. And you want to run more stuff in it. The man said why overburden one area with a bridge and gas storage facility. Congestion do not lend itself to future planning. Dem cane cutters cannot be employed in that facility, maybe their children with proper education. Storing gas is a potential bomb-consider the Lebanon explosion.

S

KP, what kind of a teacher were you? Your grammar is atrocious.

You made some good points. Are you suggesting to ship the oil up to Linden as an alternative?

Are you saying, the economic benefits will far outweigh the effects of respiratory sickness associated with this type of operation?

Mitwah
@seignet posted:

Nineteen on the Corentyne is a suitable place or Belladrum.

There is lot of land from Seawell to Fyrish where the road turns. But, they will have to improve the sea defense. Actually that #19 road was built as a sea defense to keep the water from the  Rice and Sugar Plantations, Albion, Port Mourant and Rose Hall.

Mitwah
@Mitwah posted:

KP, what kind of a teacher were you? Your grammar is atrocious.

You made some good points. Are you suggesting to ship the oil up to Linden as an alternative?

Are you saying, the economic benefits will far outweigh the effects of respiratory sickness associated with this type of operation?

First, I am not here to be lectured about grammar by dunces.

What I am saying the Demerara River has always been maintained as a Deep water channel, it is less closer to the Amazon River, thus less silt.

There are several storage facilities in Trinidad, never heard of respiratory sickness there.

The problem with you guys, nothing will be correct with the PPP, you will always find faults.

K
@kp posted:

First, I am not here to be lectured about grammar by dunces.

What I am saying the Demerara River has always been maintained as a Deep water channel, it is less closer to the Amazon River, thus less silt.

There are several storage facilities in Trinidad, never heard of respiratory sickness there.

The problem with you guys, nothing will be correct with the PPP, you will always find faults.

How did you pass your Real Estate Exams when your English is so lamentable? Please don't boast how you were an English teacher.

Mitwah
@kp posted:

First, I am not here to be lectured about grammar by dunces.

What I am saying the Demerara River has always been maintained as a Deep water channel, it is less closer to the Amazon River, thus less silt.

There are several storage facilities in Trinidad, never heard of respiratory sickness there.

The problem with you guys, nothing will be correct with the PPP, you will always find faults.

Guyanese have a right to sey wah dem tink, especially if the project is announced by the wan who gave the country Skeldon Estate. Dis fella doan care how much it cost the country, it is not his money. You should be concerned about his decisions-the man get upset when ppl differ with him. That is dangerous.

S
@Mitwah posted:

There is lot of land from Seawell to Fyrish where the road turns. But, they will have to improve the sea defense. Actually that #19 road was built as a sea defense to keep the water from the  Rice and Sugar Plantations, Albion, Port Mourant and Rose Hall.

Similar to issues in Northern British Columbia regarding opposition to petrochemical plants. Wales is too congested with marine traffic and the Dem river bridge for a gas plant to be feasible, where pollution is also a huge factor.

But a bigger question exists : The PPP manifesto promised to restored ALL sugar estates because sugar is 'king'. Is this another PPP broken promise to fool their voters and cover their asses ?

As the PPP promised, restore Wales to a working sugar factory, if Mustapha and Sase Singh have any balls left and built the gas plant away from residential areas.     

Tola
@seignet posted:

Guyanese have a right to sey wah dem tink, especially if the project is announced by the wan who gave the country Skeldon Estate. Dis fella doan care how much it cost the country, it is not his money. You should be concerned about his decisions-the man get upset when ppl differ with him. That is dangerous.

Decisions like these makes a person wonder, what kind of kickbacks are given for personal profit. While the Guyanese people are left holding the debt and a defective project, for generations.   

Tola
Last edited by Tola

How about the most critical question:  Does a gas plant make financial/environmental sense?  Some experts like Dr. Janki think that it doesn't and she provided her supporting arguments to the Guyanese press.   Among other things, she suggested that gas is worthless, which is why ExxonMobil has burnt large amounts of it in Guyana.  The intended project will be very expensive , saddling Guyana with more debt and taking a worthless resource off Exxon's hands.

T
@Mitwah posted:

How did you pass your Real Estate Exams when your English is so lamentable? Please don't boast how you were an English teacher.

Go and ask your family that question. or is right in your ass.

K
@Totaram posted:

How about the most critical question:  Does a gas plant make financial/environmental sense?  Some experts like Dr. Janki think that it doesn't and she provided her supporting arguments to the Guyanese press.   Among other things, she suggested that gas is worthless, which is why ExxonMobil has burnt large amounts of it in Guyana.  The intended project will be very expensive , saddling Guyana with more debt and taking a worthless resource off Exxon's hands.

That is the most stupid question I have read in a while. Gas is BIG business. Russia keeps Europe warm with its gas. There have been diplomatic rows between the USA and Europe about it. The US wanted to sell its shale gas to the rest of the world, until oil prices collapsed.

Exxon is disposing of the gas, whilst in Europe they make a fortune selling the gas that comes from the oil well.

Mr.T
@Mr.T posted:

That is the most stupid question I have read in a while. Gas is BIG business. Russia keeps Europe warm with its gas. There have been diplomatic rows between the USA and Europe about it. The US wanted to sell its shale gas to the rest of the world, until oil prices collapsed.

Exxon is disposing of the gas, whilst in Europe they make a fortune selling the gas that comes from the oil well.

Have you read Dr. Janki's analysis?  Why don't you before shooting crap?

T
@Mr.T posted:

That is the most stupid question I have read in a while. Gas is BIG business. Russia keeps Europe warm with its gas. There have been diplomatic rows between the USA and Europe about it. The US wanted to sell its shale gas to the rest of the world, until oil prices collapsed.

Exxon is disposing of the gas, whilst in Europe they make a fortune selling the gas that comes from the oil well.

The question being asked by Dr. Janki and others is two fold: from an economic/environmental perspective does it make sense for Guyana to invest in gas ? Would it not be more prudent to invest in renewable energy? How do you monetize the environmental effects of fossil fuels in energy generation?  Yes, gas is being used to heat homes in Europe etc. but the economic externalities are not factored into the profit calculations.  How would you, Mr. T, monetize global warming?  Have you considered the impact of burning gas on the global ecosystem? These are questions usually ignored in simple analysis.   

T
@Totaram posted:

Have you read Dr. Janki's analysis?  Why don't you before shooting crap?

Analysis? It flies in the face of the economic facts! Only a dunce with possibly fake qualifications would come up with the idea that the gas is worthless. Many factories in the developed world are now powered by electricity generated by gas power stations compared to coal not so long ago.

Mr.T
@Mr.T posted:

Analysis? It flies in the face of the economic facts! Only a dunce with possibly fake qualifications would come up with the idea that the gas is worthless. Many factories in the developed world are now powered by electricity generated by gas power stations compared to coal not so long ago.

No, it doesn't.  The economic facts on which you seem to rely do not factor in economic externalities.  Have you read Dr. Janki's analysis?  Remember the dual nature of the question: economic and environmental. 

T

What environmental impact has gas extraction had on the North sea and China sea? None. For anyone to write an analysis and suggest otherwise does call into question who funds that person to write such rubbish.

Mr.T

It is about global warming.  Burning fossil fuels is the main cause of global warming, which is not confined to any particular part of the world.  It affects every part of the integrated ecosystem of the planet.  Natural gas, oil, coal etc. are all fossil fuels.  I have no reason whatsoever to question the funding of anyone making this argument.  It is based on the truth, inconvenient as it may be.  Have you seen Al Gore's An Inconvenient Truth and its sequel?

T
@kp posted:

The writer don't seems to know the geographic location of Wales. Wales Estate is right along the bank if the Demerara River,it is approximately 6 miles from the mouth of the River. The Demerara River is already known as a deep water channel, large ships used to ply along to the bauxite Town Linden.

The socioeconomic benefits far out weighs the negatives, it is about creating employment to the West and East Banks communities, Wales and Grove which were battered by the previous administration.

Demerara is the middle county closer for large marine vessels to travel to North America and through the Panama canal to Asia and Europe. Exxon will also be involved, they may use as a storage base, while Guyana will use for holding for marketing purpose.

Large marine vessels? There is a limit to that because of siltng from the Amazon river!

FM
@Totaram posted:

It is about global warming.  Burning fossil fuels is the main cause of global warming, which is not confined to any particular part of the world.  It affects every part of the integrated ecosystem of the planet.  Natural gas, oil, coal etc. are all fossil fuels.  I have no reason whatsoever to question the funding of anyone making this argument.  It is based on the truth, inconvenient as it may be.  Have you seen Al Gore's An Inconvenient Truth and its sequel?

Everything is the same as it was eons ago, except for additional meteors! Al Gore is a convenient idiot! Have you had your convenient 'vaccine' as yet?

'

FM
Last edited by Former Member
@Totaram posted:

It is about global warming.  Burning fossil fuels is the main cause of global warming, which is not confined to any particular part of the world.  It affects every part of the integrated ecosystem of the planet.  Natural gas, oil, coal etc. are all fossil fuels.  I have no reason whatsoever to question the funding of anyone making this argument.  It is based on the truth, inconvenient as it may be.  Have you seen Al Gore's An Inconvenient Truth and its sequel?

Tell me, Ram, does a glass of water with ice floating on top overflow when the ice melts?

I would also go with Janki! She knows more than Jagdeo and crew will ever know from Exxon, a seller of gas! And hot air!

FM
Last edited by Former Member
@Mr.T posted:

Analysis? It flies in the face of the economic facts! Only a dunce with possibly fake qualifications would come up with the idea that the gas is worthless. Many factories in the developed world are now powered by electricity generated by gas power stations compared to coal not so long ago.

And your qualifications are better than Janki's I suppose!

FM
@Former Member posted:

Everything is the same as it was eons ago, except for additional meteors! Al Gore is a convenient idiot! Have you had your convenient 'vaccine' as yet?

I want that vaccine but I have to wait my turn.

T
Last edited by Django
@Former Member posted:

Tell me, Ram, does a glass of water with ice floating on top overflow when the ice melts?

I would also go with Janki! She knows more than Jagdeo and crew will ever know from Exxon, a seller of gas! And hot air!

Maybe we could Rama to run the ice/water experiment. 

T
@Former Member posted:

Large marine vessels? There is a limit to that because of siltng from the Amazon river!

I can remember those large Saugany ships sailing up and down the Demerara River to McKenzie to transport Bauxite. Transport and Harbor had dredges on boat to clean the channel.

K
@kp posted:

First, I am not here to be lectured about grammar by dunces.

What I am saying the Demerara River has always been maintained as a Deep water channel, it is less closer to the Amazon River, thus less silt.

There are several storage facilities in Trinidad, never heard of respiratory sickness there.

The problem with you guys, nothing will be correct with the PPP, you will always find faults.

Mind explaining what the proximity of the Demerara river to the Amazon river has to do with silt?

GTAngler
@kp posted:

I can remember those large Saugany ships sailing up and down the Demerara River to McKenzie to transport Bauxite. Transport and Harbor had dredges on boat to clean the channel.

Yeah?Now think of ships carrying containers! Think they will enter the Demeara ribber? it's not ole' Man Ribber, y'know!

FM
Last edited by Former Member
@GTAngler posted:

Mind explaining what the proximity of the Demerara river to the Amazon river has to do with silt?

Since primary school, I've been told that the reason they have to dredge is because the river gets silted up from the silt flowing from the Amazon Ribber to de Atlantic den down to de Demerara Ribber! Dey tel yu diffrunt, huh?

FM
@Totaram posted:

I want that vaccine but I have to wait my turn.

I can't find it now but there was an article where some female doctor or whatever is claiming that those taking the vaccine may be dead in 3 months! I'm going to miss you Ram.....goat!

FM
@Former Member posted:

I can't find it now but there was an article where some female doctor or whatever is claiming that those taking the vaccine may be dead in 3 months! I'm going to miss you Ram.....goat!

I haven't taken it as yet but it will be offered to you first and if you don't take it I will miss you.

T
@GTAngler posted:

Mind explaining what the proximity of the Demerara river to the Amazon river has to do with silt?

Same reason a toilet's proximity to you when you have diarrhea! gotta dump somewhere! De closa, de betta!

FM
@Totaram posted:

I haven't taken it as yet but it will be offered to you first and if you don't take it I will miss you.

Must be love! You say such nice things to me, Ramalanglang!

I've had it now 7 times, cured it each time! I told you peepul what to do, even told you to wear the stupid mask (I don't wear any) while you do the exercise, but you need an M.D. behind my name for you to believe! Only doctors can think, huh? So you let them think for you! Hahahahahahaha.......

See here : Coronavirus: Volunteer in AstraZeneca's Covid vaccine trial dies in Brazil | Daily Mail Online

He didn't believe so he took the placebo! Same daid!

FM
Last edited by Former Member
@kp posted:

First, I am not here to be lectured about grammar by dunces.

What I am saying the Demerara River has always been maintained as a Deep water channel, it is less closer to the Amazon River, thus less silt.

There are several storage facilities in Trinidad, never heard of respiratory sickness there.

The problem with you guys, nothing will be correct with the PPP, you will always find faults.

Uh, kp, the Essequibo is silted up, too! But Garjetung iz ware de capital iz an den dare iz Linden an de baxite! Naow, Mits iz gun critisize mih, two! Woe iz mih!

FM
Last edited by Former Member

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