caribny posted:
ksazma posted:

Cribby doesn’t seem to get tired of moaning and groaning about black this and black that. We all had to overcome some kind of challenge. Can’t continue to make them excuses.

Iam sorry that I will chat about "black this and black that" because YOU chat about "black this and black that".

When you scream that blacks are evil people what are you doing?  And statistical evidence has been found to tell you that Indo Guyanese are no more successful than are Afro Guyanese, either within Guyana or outside of it.  1/3 of BOTH populations are mired in poverty.

Banna, I never talked about black this and black that until I got tired of reading your moaning and groaning about black this and black that. I don’t care to worry about the things that you are obsessed with.

caribny posted:
Baseman posted:
 

 

Stop speaking of the irrelevant.  There was just an LGE and there were no complaints.  Their voters turned out and was able to vote.  The dead people never showed up. 

GECOM said that list that they had was good only until April 2019.  The previous house to house was in 2008. 

How come a house to house was needed then and not now?

Listen you all know full well the problems with voter lists in Guyana.  Why doesn't the PPP demand a process where transparent and verifiable lists be available BEFORE the election?   Using a list that is 11 years old, riddled with dead people and possibly excluding people who came of age since then makes no sense.  And please don't tell people to line up all day at some gov't office either. 

Even in NYC we have problems.  Every time there is an elections THOUSANDS of people show up to vote to be told that their name isn't on the list of registered voters, this even though they voted in prior elections and haven't changed their address.  FL is notorious for this problem as well.  Last year in GA there were also problems with people being removed.

The voter list has to be cleansed and I don't care how it is done but it needs to be done.

Here is what I suggest.  If the PPP screams that there is no need for a House to House then they must accept what ever happens on election day.   If PPP supporters show up and are told that they cannot vote, and if votes in PNC regions look bloated then the PPP must accept that, because they didn't demand a thorough scrubbing of the voter list.

The process must be this.  House to House verification followed by a publishing of the names on the list acceptable for people to verify and challenge.  The list should also be scrubbed for deaths since the last verification.

There is NO LAW that requires H2H registration. 

 

The law caters for a first list to be generated by house-to-house registration. And from that first list, it is to be constantly refreshed by periods of Continuous Registration and Claims And Objections.”

 

No person attaining the age of 18 will be disenfranchised, because a Claims and Objections period captures those persons. So house-to-house registration is just a ploy to delay the elections further,” he added.

 

Registration is catered for under Section 6 of the National Registration Act Cap 19:08, with the intent of having those 14 and over included on the National Register of Registrants. On August 4, 2005, then President Bharrat Jagdeo assented to amendments of the Act by including provisions for Continuous Registration.
These amendments were in keeping with an international push away from house-to-house registration and towards Continuous Registration as the more effective method of registering voters.
According to Section 6 (A) of the Amendments, “the Elections Commission shall use the Official List Of Electors from the 2001 General and Regional Elections as the base to commence continuing registration”.
This meant that persons not on the 2001 Official List of Electors were legally required to visit registration offices in their respective registration areas to apply to be included on the list (though it is understood that GECOM officers would usually visit the homes of those who are disabled). The same holds true for the next (and last) time house-to-house registration would be done, which was in 2008.

https://guyanatimesgy.com/hous...-gecom-commissioner/

ksazma posted:

Banna, I never talked about black this and black that until I got tired of reading your moaning and groaning about black this and black that. I don’t care to worry about the things that you are obsessed with.

there are few things more contemptible than a coward who can’t even LIE properly

you are a poorly educated little racist with a primitive IDEOLOGICAL loathing of Black people

why you (intermittently) even make attempts to cover up what your every-day-all-year compulsions on GNI make clear remains a mystery to me

smh

Looks like the opened the sewer again today. The filth must be so horrendous that it required exhaustion two days in a row. Only a fool would believe that someone can be a coward over the Internet. Especially someone like myself who doesn’t give a rats ass about such things.

ksazma posted:

Only a fool would believe that someone can be a coward over the Internet. Especially someone like myself who doesn’t give a rats ass about such things.

suuure . . . you dunce

one thing about me, i don’t bray like a punk into the wind like you . . . i SHOW!

noting that admin had to close the thread below because of your embarrassing hate speech there

https://guyana.hoop.la/topic/j...agenda-charles-ceres

and that’s saying something given the abysmal ‘standards’ here

yesss . . . that’s your scavenging, mangy dog grunting there towards the end

ksazma posted:
.

Banna, I never talked about black this and black that until I got tired of reading your moaning and groaning about black this and black that. I don’t care to worry about the things that you are obsessed with.

You also wail about "Indians this and Indian that" Screams about daily rapes and killings of Indians and you have also done so.  All the cries about how Indians suffered under the PNC.  '

Funny that you don't like it if I told you that your whining about the PNC is the same victimhood that you accuse blacks of having towards the PPP.

Really the only difference in political behavior between the two groups lies in their attitude to ethnicity and nationality.  Blacks (as well as mixed and Portuguese) Guyanese view their primary identity as Guyanese with their ethnicity defining the type of Guyanese they are. 

This is why in Guyana a dougla can be seen as being black, or mixed, but never as an Indian, unless he can pass for one.

Indians see themselves as primarily Indian with their Guyanese identity to determine what kind of Indian they are.  And don't deny this until you are ready to tell us why the PPP's campaign plank was about "Moses say he not an Indian".  Granger has NEVER been asked what identity rooted in the continent of Africa he connects to.

Aside from that both vote race and condone abusive behavior by "their party", yet ironically wail that "their party" treats the other tribe preferentially.  They both vote out of fear of ethnic extinction, as neither have much good to say about their tribal leaders. That you cannot see this just shows what a bigot you are.

caribny posted:
Stormborn posted:

The franchise is voluntary. Everyone who wants to register should on their own volition go to their local post office ( should be an option), uplift a registration form and a self addressed envelope and stamp, fill it in and mail it into the designated office.  This period can extend until a few weeks before the polls. I see no objection to a person being allowed same day registration.

The House to House registration does not grantee the authenticity of the list. Political agents posing as canvassers can pad the list.  Only a registration form filled in by an individual at a designated address and signed by said individual and lodged at the commissions office guarantee the eligibility of the voter. It is the only way the individual should gets on the roll. 

We need to get into the modern era. Voting is voluntary and the idea that you have to ferret out the voter by using government paid agents to harvest a voter file is an absurdity. Anyone wanting to vote and having an interest in voting should have options to register on their own volition. No one is going to take them to jail if they do not vote. 

OK so use an old list and when all of these young PPP supporters show up to vote let them be told that their names aren't on the list and so they cannot vote.

that is not what I said. The old list must be purged of its dead people and people who left the country using exit data and death listings. Anyone who wants to be registered can and should be allowed to register with presentation of id and personal information. They can also register when getting a license etc' I know they do not collect post office data yet but in time that should be another way of cleaning the list. It is absurd to have to go and harvest a voters list by house to house registration every five years in a democracy. A workable list depends on the plan to register and clean the list continuously so that elections can always be viable in 90 days. 

GTAngler posted:
caribny posted:
Stormborn posted:

The franchise is voluntary. Everyone who wants to register should on their own volition go to their local post office ( should be an option), uplift a registration form and a self addressed envelope and stamp, fill it in and mail it into the designated office.  This period can extend until a few weeks before the polls. I see no objection to a person being allowed same day registration.

The House to House registration does not grantee the authenticity of the list. Political agents posing as canvassers can pad the list.  Only a registration form filled in by an individual at a designated address and signed by said individual and lodged at the commissions office guarantee the eligibility of the voter. It is the only way the individual should gets on the roll. 

We need to get into the modern era. Voting is voluntary and the idea that you have to ferret out the voter by using government paid agents to harvest a voter file is an absurdity. Anyone wanting to vote and having an interest in voting should have options to register on their own volition. No one is going to take them to jail if they do not vote. 

OK so use an old list and when all of these young PPP supporters show up to vote let them be told that their names aren't on the list and so they cannot vote.

Why not get rid of all existing lists and let people register/re-register? Only the people who are actually interested in voting will make sure they register. No phantom or jumbie or duplicate etc. lists.

We are a democracy so list making and verification should be the local district problem. They should be mandated to keep accurate lists of who reside in and who participate in their local government. 

Stormborn posted:
 

that is not what I said. The old list must be purged of its dead people and people who left the country using exit data and death listings. Anyone who wants to be registered can and should be allowed to register with presentation of id and personal information. They can also register when getting a license etc' I know they do not collect post office data yet but in time that should be another way of cleaning the list. It is absurd to have to go and harvest a voters list by house to house registration every five years in a democracy. A workable list depends on the plan to register and clean the list continuously so that elections can always be viable in 90 days. 

Whatever methods that are used there isn't going to be an election in the near term.  And this is NOT what Jagdeo is demanding.

Any revisions will have to be verifiably transparent.  You know full well that two aged men rubbing their hands with greed and power lust (that is Jagdeo and Harmon) cannot be trusted to do with without eyes watching them.

We couldn't get an election under a new constitution so at least we need one with a proper voter list and you aren't going to get that done in 2 weeks.  Given anticipations that Guyana will be wealthy and that benefits will accrue to those affiliated with those in power this will be a far more important election than we have had for a while.  If you think that tribal paranoias were fierce before they have become even moreso now. 

There is a lot of hype about what GY will supposedly become and so the tribal stakes are even higher than they ever were.

As to all of those sources of information that you think people have.  If its a major project to get a birth certificate you think that all of that data is lying around the place?   I bet its not doable within a 90 day period, given how primitive GY is.

ronan posted:
ksazma posted:

Banna, I never talked about black this and black that until I got tired of reading your moaning and groaning about black this and black that. I don’t care to worry about the things that you are obsessed with.

there are few things more contemptible than a coward who can’t even LIE properly

you are a poorly educated little racist with a primitive IDEOLOGICAL loathing of Black people

why you (intermittently) even make attempts to cover up what your every-day-all-year compulsions on GNI make clear remains a mystery to me

smh

If we knocked on his door and offered him some beers or rum the man would run squealing behind his wife wailing "call de police, call de police, dem evil black man gone kill me!"

Those who boast about how brave they are usually are big cowards.  Cowardice is a feature of ageing PPP men.  I used to see them in Richmond Hill.  They couldn't even look at me straight in the eye and shake my hand firmly, even as Cheddi in those days was telling them to outreach to blacks.  This is why they hail RK as a hero even as he paid renegade blacks to kill off each other.

Stormborn posted:
 

 

We are a democracy so list making and verification should be the local district problem. They should be mandated to keep accurate lists of who reside in and who participate in their local government. 

What should be and what is aren't the same. What local government does Guyana have?  They cannot even collect garbage.  Yet you expect them to manage complex data bases where they must track who was born and then turned 18, who died and who left the district.

caribny posted:
Stormborn posted:
 

that is not what I said. The old list must be purged of its dead people and people who left the country using exit data and death listings. Anyone who wants to be registered can and should be allowed to register with presentation of id and personal information. They can also register when getting a license etc' I know they do not collect post office data yet but in time that should be another way of cleaning the list. It is absurd to have to go and harvest a voters list by house to house registration every five years in a democracy. A workable list depends on the plan to register and clean the list continuously so that elections can always be viable in 90 days. 

Whatever methods that are used there isn't going to be an election in the near term.  And this is NOT what Jagdeo is demanding.

Any revisions will have to be verifiably transparent.  You know full well that two aged men rubbing their hands with greed and power lust (that is Jagdeo and Harmon) cannot be trusted to do with without eyes watching them.

We couldn't get an election under a new constitution so at least we need one with a proper voter list and you aren't going to get that done in 2 weeks.  Given anticipations that Guyana will be wealthy and that benefits will accrue to those affiliated with those in power this will be a far more important election than we have had for a while.  If you think that tribal paranoias were fierce before they have become even moreso now. 

There is a lot of hype about what GY will supposedly become and so the tribal stakes are even higher than they ever were.

As to all of those sources of information that you think people have.  If its a major project to get a birth certificate you think that all of that data is lying around the place?   I bet its not doable within a 90 day period, given how primitive GY is.

Purging the list can be a simple problem of creating a list of those who were added since the last two cycles and checking them for validity. A statistical protocol can be used to gather data to substantiate the list after cleaning.  That number should be around 70 k after dead people are removed etc. I am not intimidated with who are prone to violence. I am guided by the truth and the through is house to house registration is irrelevant in a modern democracy. It is the voter's right to get on the list by voluntarily submitting their application at a designation collection site. 

caribny posted:
Stormborn posted:
 

 

We are a democracy so list making and verification should be the local district problem. They should be mandated to keep accurate lists of who reside in and who participate in their local government. 

What should be and what is aren't the same. What local government does Guyana have?  They cannot even collect garbage.  Yet you expect them to manage complex data bases where they must track who was born and then turned 18, who died and who left the district.

I am not here to accommodate the political strategy of others. I am suggesting the absurdity of H@H in light of the responsibility of potential voters to register in their local area and the maintaining of a master list by GECOM. 

Perhaps you should consider that I don't technically speak directly to you because that would be given you more legitimacy that you deserve. While I can understand you craving me giving you more legitimacy it is not my responsibility to worry about your sense of worth or lack thereof.

Remember it was you who wailed like a lil p ussy that you were leaving GNI because no one was taking you seriously. Yet you are still here under a different name but with the same irrelevance. One thing is for sure, I come here and leave at my own free will. But the first time I am suspended from GNI, I would be gone forever. No new handle. No wailing about how Admin is not fair and all the other shit you indulge in.

When the house to house count was done, it was intended to be a one time deal to get the voters' list current. The expectation was that the list will thereafter be maintained through everyday updating it. The PNC are only using this as an excuse to delay elections because they don't believe in democracy.

Baseman posted:

Banna, the problem with the voters list is irrelevant. Yes, it’s bloated due to deaths and emigration.  However, they don’t vote. As long as the living is on the list, that’s what matters.  

The last LGE proved the list was fine for the eligible voters. So you making something out of nothing!

This is all BS!

Banna, what faaat yuh talking? The bloating of the list due to deaths and emigration IS a major problem! And those people do "vote"! This is the crux of the matter, whoever the ruling party is or has control of the polls in their district can pad the votes with votes from the dead and immigrated! Fat boy did it and the PPP did it and were trying to do it last time.

LGE is not proof of anything. Most people don't vote in LGE and there is nothing "big" at stake in the minds of most local Guyanese.

Not sure house to house is the best remedy, but that list needs to be cleaned up!

Iguana posted:
Baseman posted:

Banna, the problem with the voters list is irrelevant. Yes, it’s bloated due to deaths and emigration.  However, they don’t vote. As long as the living is on the list, that’s what matters.  

The last LGE proved the list was fine for the eligible voters. So you making something out of nothing!

This is all BS!

Banna, what faaat yuh talking? The bloating of the list due to deaths and emigration IS a major problem! And those people do "vote"! This is the crux of the matter, whoever the ruling party is or has control of the polls in their district can pad the votes with votes from the dead and immigrated! Fat boy did it and the PPP did it and were trying to do it last time.

LGE is not proof of anything. Most people don't vote in LGE and there is nothing "big" at stake in the minds of most local Guyanese.

Not sure house to house is the best remedy, but that list needs to be cleaned up!

Bannaz, here where I come down.  And I am being neutral.  My Guyanese family split on PPP or Coalition.  The only person who declared is the 85 year old matriarch and she love Granger.  And I have US family in both camps.  And you know, Granger used to come and eat bake and solfish in me basement apartment!

It's better to have too many than missing voters.  And yes, the LGE saw lower turnout than will the GE however, the List at the LGE did not discriminate who would or would not show up.  So it had to be complete.  The mere fact that there were no major issues of those choosing to vote being excluded, tells me the list was good for all valid voters.

So, I say use the list while continue to prune for confirmed deceased.  Implement a strong and rigid control at polling centers to unsure only live, valid voters ballots get into the box.  The SOP is there to validate the counting at the central stations.

I don't see having excess as a big a risk and the Govt going on a total overhaul of the list and risk missing many valid voters.

Stormborn posted:
 

I am not here to accommodate the political strategy of others. I am suggesting the absurdity of H@H in light of the responsibility of potential voters to register in their local area and the maintaining of a master list by GECOM. 

Tell me something.  Do you think that the US electoral process is efficient?  It isnt.  GA and FL are corrupt dens of voter suppression, as is NY.  And so is Guyana.

So why isnt it a priority to install a process where people can at least have confidence in the voter list, even if they dont with the constitution under which the election is held?

Yes if Coalition wins you are going to hear PPP screams of all of the little Indian kids who couldn't vote and of all the old dead blacks who did.

I am also amused by those who screamed that the constitution was bad but now hold it as if its the bible. The PPP doesnt care damn all about the constitution  or whether the electoral process is transparent.  They are in a race to be positioned before "first oil" as that will allow them permanent control over resource allocation.

Baseman posted:
Iguana posted:
Baseman posted:

Banna, the problem with the voters list is irrelevant. Yes, it’s bloated due to deaths and emigration.  However, they don’t vote. As long as the living is on the list, that’s what matters.  

The last LGE proved the list was fine for the eligible voters. So you making something out of nothing!

This is all BS!

Banna, what faaat yuh talking? The bloating of the list due to deaths and emigration IS a major problem! And those people do "vote"! This is the crux of the matter, whoever the ruling party is or has control of the polls in their district can pad the votes with votes from the dead and immigrated! Fat boy did it and the PPP did it and were trying to do it last time.

LGE is not proof of anything. Most people don't vote in LGE and there is nothing "big" at stake in the minds of most local Guyanese.

Not sure house to house is the best remedy, but that list needs to be cleaned up!

Bannaz, here where I come down.  And I am being neutral.  My Guyanese family split on PPP or Coalition.  The only person who declared is the 85 year old matriarch and she love Granger.  And I have US family in both camps.  And you know, Granger used to come and eat bake and solfish in me basement apartment!

It's better to have too many than missing voters.  And yes, the LGE saw lower turnout than will the GE however, the List at the LGE did not discriminate who would or would not show up.  So it had to be complete.  The mere fact that there were no major issues of those choosing to vote being excluded, tells me the list was good for all valid voters.

So, I say use the list while continue to prune for confirmed deceased.  Implement a strong and rigid control at polling centers to unsure only live, valid voters ballots get into the box.  The SOP is there to validate the counting at the central stations.

I don't see having excess as a big a risk and the Govt going on a total overhaul of the list and risk missing many valid voters.

Dont make me laugh about the SOPs.  That is what hold up the process and there is even evidence of fake SOPs being used in places where certain parties lack the manpower to observe the entirety of the process.

The LGE had a 70% BOYCOTT so how do you know that this reflects an accurate list.  It is exactly those who didn't vote, who will be the ones most likely excluded.  That is the ones who have never voted before.

FACT.  GECOM is and has always been inefficient.  In times past the ABC nations even used to offer them $$$ in order to help them be ready for elections.  The voter list has to be purged.  It has to be credible.   People who have no business voting (dead people) shouldn't be on the list and those who turned 18 should be included.

If the PPP doesnt want House to House then they should offer an alternate strategy.  In fact the US Ambassador did offer a strategy before they went to the CCJ. Had they listened elections would have been next month.  Now GECOM will claim that they can do nothing until they get a chair.

The CCJ can call GECOM incompetent but they cannot force an election before GECOM says that they are ready.  That is unless they want to shoulder the blame if an election is held and is considered flawed.  You dont hold flawed elections in Jamaica and Guyana.

caribny posted:
Baseman posted:
Iguana posted:

Banna, what faaat yuh talking? The bloating of the list due to deaths and emigration IS a major problem! And those people do "vote"! This is the crux of the matter, whoever the ruling party is or has control of the polls in their district can pad the votes with votes from the dead and immigrated! Fat boy did it and the PPP did it and were trying to do it last time.

LGE is not proof of anything. Most people don't vote in LGE and there is nothing "big" at stake in the minds of most local Guyanese.

Not sure house to house is the best remedy, but that list needs to be cleaned up!

Bannaz, here where I come down.  And I am being neutral.  My Guyanese family split on PPP or Coalition.  The only person who declared is the 85 year old matriarch and she love Granger.  And I have US family in both camps.  And you know, Granger used to come and eat bake and solfish in me basement apartment!

It's better to have too many than missing voters.  And yes, the LGE saw lower turnout than will the GE however, the List at the LGE did not discriminate who would or would not show up.  So it had to be complete.  The mere fact that there were no major issues of those choosing to vote being excluded, tells me the list was good for all valid voters.

So, I say use the list while continue to prune for confirmed deceased.  Implement a strong and rigid control at polling centers to unsure only live, valid voters ballots get into the box.  The SOP is there to validate the counting at the central stations.

I don't see having excess as a big a risk and the Govt going on a total overhaul of the list and risk missing many valid voters.

Dont make me laugh about the SOPs.  That is what hold up the process and there is even evidence of fake SOPs being

Don’t make you laugh!!   You already laughing all the way to 2020!!

Baseman posted:
 

 

Don’t make you laugh!!   You already laughing all the way to 2020!!

In fact some opine that delaying elections doesnt help the Coalition as it just gives its base more time to witness their incompetence.  The treachery of Charandass has long been forgotten.

caribny posted:
Baseman posted:

Don’t make you laugh!!   You already laughing all the way to 2020!!

In fact some opine that delaying elections doesnt help the Coalition as it just gives its base more time to witness their incompetence.  The treachery of Charandass has long been forgotten.

Don't play stupid!  Their base is engaged.  Now they are out making up for things that angered their base.  As oil looms closer, people focus there!

I think the Coalition will have a strong showing!  Don't count them out.  The GT Indians are split!  PPP was well positioned, but Irfaan's appointment has taken some shine away!

Baseman posted:
 

Don't play stupid!  Their base is engaged.  !

You sure about that?  I hear their base saying that the PPP were competent thieves and the PNC are merely incompetent.

They lost the CCJ because their incompetence via Basil was so embarrassing.  Look at how that idiot thought that he could advance his argument by screaming that Charandass claims that he knew that being a dual citizen he shouldn't have been in parliament.

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