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Originally Posted by baseman:
Originally Posted by Itaname:
Originally Posted by yuji22:
100 days is not up yet and APNU is in deep water. Crisis after crisis.

 

They campaigned on a platform on change, they better act fast and at least appear to deliver. People have little patience and sympathy for politicians.

 

The Guyana economy is headed for a recession or at least a major slowdown and with the rice and sugar industry in deep deep crisis, things are looking good for Jagdeo right now.

 

President Granger must act fast and drop all deadweight ministers. Harmon should focus on the economy and consensus building rather that appearing to be on a witch hunt.

 

I spoke with a few businessmen during a recent trip to NY and they are not upbeat right now. APNU must create an atmosphere of encouraging businesses to invest. This may sound cruel but Indos have a lot of money to invest and APNU must not make the same mistake that Burnham and the PNC did.

 

Very interesting times ahead.

What move by Burnham and the PNC was so offensive to the "Indos with a lot of money", eh? You all were richer and fatter at the end of Burnham's reign because of your smuggling and black marketing to yuh mattie! More than half alyuh had PNC card. So spare us the bullshit!

I guess you don't get it.  Where(If) ever you lived in Guyana was a million miles from the life of the average Indian in Guyana under PNC tyrany.  Anyway, it does not matter, it is what it is.  What I can say, the PPP today is far more potent and powerful than the PPP pre-1992.  HE Granger has honorable intentions and many want to cooperate however, if he don't rein in the racist Burnhamite faction who wants to re-establish the old order, he will become collateral damage.  If he cares about his legacy, he needs to reverse some of the victory-euphoric actions and revert to his campaign mantra, an inclusive leader.  He will be given the chance, but people will not wait too long.  Granger has made some mis-steps and thus the rapid repercussions, including the Venezuela fiasco, a monumental error.

Baseman,

 

What does any of your post have to do with my response? I mentioned "Indos with a lot of money" (yugi's words). Not the average Indian. I ask again, what was it that Burnham did to rich indian people who thrived under his rule?

 

The rest of your post is the usual ranting and raving of half truths and speculation that I am much too tired to address.

FM
Originally Posted by Ramakant-P:
Originally Posted by Wally:

I think this may be a very wrong ruling and must be overruled in some way. There has to be strict term limits when it comes to this job.  There should only be one Presidential term of 6 years. You cannot run for the office again after that. The of nature of Guyana politics causes the job to bring with it severe mental stress and psychological issues.  

That is your opinion and your are entitled to it.  I hope you see how asinine it sounds. 

Ram, this is a very dangerous decision. I hope that the person who becomes mentally ill on the job is not an mortal enemy of yours because your a-s will be on fire then or better yet you may be executed by aircraft gun Kim Jong Un style. 

Wally
Last edited by Wally
Originally Posted by Wally:
Originally Posted by Ramakant-P:
Originally Posted by Wally:

I think this may be a very wrong ruling and must be overruled in some way. There has to be strict term limits when it comes to this job.  There should only be one Presidential term of 6 years. You cannot run for the office again after that. The of nature of Guyana politics causes the job to bring with it severe mental stress and psychological issues.  

That is your opinion and your are entitled to it.  I hope you see how asinine it sounds. 

Ram, this is a very dangerous decision. I hope that the person who becomes mentally ill on the job is not an mortal enemy of yours because your a-s will be on fire then. 

The reality here is the present administration given their interpretation of the constitution and the fact the sitting assembly is 100 percent controlled by them can immediately address these problems and reverse the court ruling by legislation.

FM
Originally Posted by Itaname:
Originally Posted by baseman:
Originally Posted by Itaname:
Originally Posted by yuji22:
100 days is not up yet and APNU is in deep water. Crisis after crisis.

 

They campaigned on a platform on change, they better act fast and at least appear to deliver. People have little patience and sympathy for politicians.

 

The Guyana economy is headed for a recession or at least a major slowdown and with the rice and sugar industry in deep deep crisis, things are looking good for Jagdeo right now.

 

President Granger must act fast and drop all deadweight ministers. Harmon should focus on the economy and consensus building rather that appearing to be on a witch hunt.

 

I spoke with a few businessmen during a recent trip to NY and they are not upbeat right now. APNU must create an atmosphere of encouraging businesses to invest. This may sound cruel but Indos have a lot of money to invest and APNU must not make the same mistake that Burnham and the PNC did.

 

Very interesting times ahead.

What move by Burnham and the PNC was so offensive to the "Indos with a lot of money", eh? You all were richer and fatter at the end of Burnham's reign because of your smuggling and black marketing to yuh mattie! More than half alyuh had PNC card. So spare us the bullshit!

I guess you don't get it.  Where(If) ever you lived in Guyana was a million miles from the life of the average Indian in Guyana under PNC tyrany.  Anyway, it does not matter, it is what it is.  What I can say, the PPP today is far more potent and powerful than the PPP pre-1992.  HE Granger has honorable intentions and many want to cooperate however, if he don't rein in the racist Burnhamite faction who wants to re-establish the old order, he will become collateral damage.  If he cares about his legacy, he needs to reverse some of the victory-euphoric actions and revert to his campaign mantra, an inclusive leader.  He will be given the chance, but people will not wait too long.  Granger has made some mis-steps and thus the rapid repercussions, including the Venezuela fiasco, a monumental error.

Baseman,

 

What does any of your post have to do with my response? I mentioned "Indos with a lot of money" (yugi's words). Not the average Indian. I ask again, what was it that Burnham did to rich indian people who thrived under his rule?

 

The rest of your post is the usual ranting and raving of half truths and speculation that I am much too tired to address.

Please see me red highlighted text above.

FM
Originally Posted by Stormborn:
Originally Posted by Wally:
Originally Posted by Ramakant-P:
Originally Posted by Wally:

I think this may be a very wrong ruling and must be overruled in some way. There has to be strict term limits when it comes to this job.  There should only be one Presidential term of 6 years. You cannot run for the office again after that. The of nature of Guyana politics causes the job to bring with it severe mental stress and psychological issues.  

That is your opinion and your are entitled to it.  I hope you see how asinine it sounds. 

Ram, this is a very dangerous decision. I hope that the person who becomes mentally ill on the job is not an mortal enemy of yours because your a-s will be on fire then. 

The reality here is the present administration given their interpretation of the constitution and the fact the sitting assembly is 100 percent controlled by them can immediately address these problems and reverse the court ruling by legislation.

My friend, even with separation of powers the Courts always have the final decision on Constitutional issues.  The courts decides if the law written by the legislature is unconstitutional once it is challenged and brought before the court.  Maybe I missed your argument because I thought you would know this.

FM
Originally Posted by Wally:

The term limit serves its purpose for a reason.  It is to protect the person holding the job and the Guyanese people from the mental stress and psychological strain that the job brings with it.  It is very dangerous to play politics or some legal argument with it.

Read Article 93 of the Constitution before you make this kind of statement.

 

Vish Mahabir also needs to read it since one of his responses to me in SN was along this line.

FM
Originally Posted by VVP:
Originally Posted by Wally:

The term limit serves its purpose for a reason.  It is to protect the person holding the job and the Guyanese people from the mental stress and psychological strain that the job brings with it.  It is very dangerous to play politics or some legal argument with it.

Read Article 93 of the Constitution before you make this kind of statement.

 

Vish Mahabir also needs to read it since one of his responses to me in SN was along this line.

You should get real, live in the real world of Guyana politics and stop sugar coating this dangerous decision.

Wally
Last edited by Wally
Originally Posted by Wally:
Originally Posted by VVP:
Originally Posted by Wally:

The term limit serves its purpose for a reason.  It is to protect the person holding the job and the Guyanese people from the mental stress and psychological strain that the job brings with it.  It is very dangerous to play politics or some legal argument with it.

Read Article 93 of the Constitution before you make this kind of statement.

 

Vish Mahabir also needs to read it since one of his responses to me in SN was along this line.

You should get real, live in the real world of Guyana politics and stop sugar coating this dangerous decision.

Did you read Article 93?  What is it about?

FM
Originally Posted by VVP:
Originally Posted by Wally:
Originally Posted by VVP:
Originally Posted by Wally:

The term limit serves its purpose for a reason.  It is to protect the person holding the job and the Guyanese people from the mental stress and psychological strain that the job brings with it.  It is very dangerous to play politics or some legal argument with it.

Read Article 93 of the Constitution before you make this kind of statement.

 

Vish Mahabir also needs to read it since one of his responses to me in SN was along this line.

You should get real, live in the real world of Guyana politics and stop sugar coating this dangerous decision.

Did you read Article 93?  What is it about?

Just for Wally:

Article 93:

The President may be removed from office if he becomes physically or mentally incapable of discharging the functions of his office.  The procedure for removing him and for ensuring the continued discharge of the functions of his office is prescribed by article 179.

FM
Originally Posted by VVP:
Originally Posted by VVP:

Excerpts from SN 7/10/15

 

In addition to allowing Jagdeo to seek re-election, Justice Chang’s ruling also appears to enable persons who have become Guyanese citizens by virtue of registration to run for president, as well as to invalidate a requirement that candidates be resident in Guyana on nomination day and for at least seven years prior.

 

According to Justice Chang’s ruling, while there is no doubt that Parliament could have altered Article 90 by a two-thirds majority of all the elected members of the National Assembly, by virtue of the fact that the alterations diluted and further restricted democratic sovereignty, the holding of a referendum was required.

I don't think the bold above is correct.  Guyana Constitution prior to this amendment required you to be a born citizen...from my memory.

Well SN is correct; prior to amendment in 2001 you only needed to be a citizen to run for President. I got this from reading Chang's ruling...what a way to use up my day off 

FM

From Chang's ruling:

 

It is crucially important to appreciate that Article 164 of the Constitution is but a procedural provision and that, being procedural, it is merely the handmaiden and not the master of the substantive provisions of the Constitution – especially those substantive provisions with which the normative characteristics of Guyana as an indivisible, secular, democratic and sovereign State can be identified.  While it is true that no provision of the Constitution of Guyana is immutable or immune from alteration, it would not be legally possible for a majority or 2/3 majority of all the elected members of the National Assembly to alter a provision of the Constitution in diminution or dilution of the normative characteristics which define and determine Guyana as an indivisible, secular, democratic and sovereign State.  Otherwise, a majority or 2/3 majority of the elected members of the Assembly would be supreme and not the Constitution itself so that the Constitution itself could be denuded of its essential normative character by the National AssemblyOne cannot mechanically use the procedural provision of the Constitution (Article 164) in isolation to subvert the Constitution itself.  That would be possible only with the approval of the electorate.

FM
Originally Posted by Gupta:

Chang is the 1st one to go. He wants to create Jagdeo as a Dictator, a little Putin. Is this the best the PPP has to offer? Clearly there is a BIG disconnect between the Gang of 8, who ruined the PPP party, and the PPP supporters.

If people do not realize, this ruling by the Acting Chief Justice Chang is a victory for the PEOPLE over the legislature (Parliament). Forget about Jagdeo he is
not going anywhere. Yes, I am in favor of term limits but what Trotman, Roopnarine, and the rest of them did was to trample on you THE PEOPLE rights. 
Amendments in 2001 ALSO treated Guyanese as second class citizens by including provisions on 7 years residency for overseas based Guyanese to run for President. Hardly anyone overseas would care to return and run for President but that does not give the Lords power to treat us as dirt. This is also addressed in the ruling. Read it.

FM

Having had a chance to read the ruling, I concur with VVP here. It's well reasoned, well grounded in the law, and more importantly difficult to overturn on a good day.

 

If the PPP had a little brains, they would sue for the implementation of overseas voting while they still have some influence over the judiciary.

FM
Originally Posted by gogo:

Jagdeo lost in 2011, lost in 2015, he was the front man hoping to landslide the coolie votes with his apan jaat, which fool thinks he can now landslide the coolie votes in 2020?  The coolie is wiser today from the Jagan time.

Whatever you think, the coolies will stick together and vote for the PPP in 2020.   Moses and Ramjattan will not be able to fool them again.  Moses and ramjattan are two of the top three people in the Government and this spells trouble for the Alliance.  If these ex PPP jackasses are all they can find to run the Government, then as Nehru and Nuff  said,"Guyana is going for Channa''.

R
Originally Posted by Ramakant-P:
Originally Posted by gogo:

Jagdeo lost in 2011, lost in 2015, he was the front man hoping to landslide the coolie votes with his apan jaat, which fool thinks he can now landslide the coolie votes in 2020?  The coolie is wiser today from the Jagan time.

Whatever you think, the coolies will stick together and vote for the PPP in 2020.   Moses and Ramjattan will not be able to fool them again.  Moses and ramjattan are two of the top three people in the Government and this spells trouble for the Alliance.  If these ex PPP jackasses are all they can find to run the Government, then as Nehru and Nuff  said,"Guyana is going for Channa''.

Maybe "c00lies", but not all the "Indians" and not other ethnicities.  The PNC still have time to make amends and correct some of their early missteps. The current PPP construct provides an opportunity to the current Govt.  It was this group which were voted out however, the shift away is very tenuous and contingent on the PNC proving they can actually do better.

FM
Originally Posted by Ramakant-P:

Whatever you think, the coolies will stick together and vote for the PPP in 2020. 

 

Keep F-ing dreamin chap! The days of artificial coolie unity are over. You can win 90pc of the Indos from now and still lose. 10pc Indos will not return to the PPP to vote in the same idiots.

 

Ayuh gon be in de Opposition for years and years to come. I'm sure ayuh have plenty more elections to lose since the message didn't register in 2011 and 2015.

FM
Originally Posted by Shaitaan:
Originally Posted by Ramakant-P:

Whatever you think, the coolies will stick together and vote for the PPP in 2020. 

 

Keep F-ing dreamin chap! The days of artificial coolie unity are over. You can win 90pc of the Indos from now and still lose. 10pc Indos will not return to the PPP to vote in the same idiots.

 

Ayuh gon be in de Opposition for years and years to come. I'm sure ayuh have plenty more elections to lose since the message didn't register in 2011 and 2015.

WEll1  you don't know Indian people.  Have you seen Indians consorting with the PNC. Even those who voted for them are avoiding coming in comtact with those monkeys. 

both times 50% of the votes went to the PPP.  They are not about to lose that.   What is your PNC doing for the Indians of Guyana?  Nothing! Nothing!

You bag of worms.

R
Originally Posted by Ramakant-P:
Originally Posted by Shaitaan:
Originally Posted by Ramakant-P:

Whatever you think, the coolies will stick together and vote for the PPP in 2020. 

 

Keep F-ing dreamin chap! The days of artificial coolie unity are over. You can win 90pc of the Indos from now and still lose. 10pc Indos will not return to the PPP to vote in the same idiots.

 

Ayuh gon be in de Opposition for years and years to come. I'm sure ayuh have plenty more elections to lose since the message didn't register in 2011 and 2015.

WEll1  you don't know Indian people.  Have you seen Indians consorting with the PNC. Even those who voted for them are avoiding coming in comtact with those monkeys. 

both times 50% of the votes went to the PPP.  They are not about to lose that.   What is your PNC doing for the Indians of Guyana?  Nothing! Nothing!

You bag of worms.

Rama, 49% they got; BIG difference.  And it was the Indians that voted against them that caused them to get only 49%.  Rama why you trying to sacrifice Indians like you did Sita 

FM
Originally Posted by redux:

Jagdeo enjoying his superstar turn courtesy of an idle media

 

take the damn thing to the CCJ already arite? and attend to the mountains of important shyte that urgently need attending to

 

smh

Agreed, the media is Guyana is extremely incompetent.  Only Adam Harris and Kaiteur News had tried a thing in the past but of late they and all got tired.

FM
Originally Posted by KishanB:

Even more important to change the consitution now and go to the referendum.  Let us reduce the power of the Presidency, along with all other measures and then go to the people to keep the 2 terms in place.  Simple story.

 

Plus we can also go to the CCJ.

Just tell them to take out that 7 years residency requirement and I will be on board.  I cannot understand how overseas based Guyanese are not more vocal about being treated like second class citizens by the likes of Roopnarine who defended that provision when I questioned it in SN in 2001. 

Of course Freddie Kissoon got in the fray with me to back the provision because "he stayed and fight"...he failed to tell people that he was in Grenada when the real WPA revolution was going on.

FM
Originally Posted by redux:

Jagdeo enjoying his superstar turn courtesy of an idle media and antiman sycophants

 

take the damn thing to the CCJ already arite? and attend to the mountains of important shyte that urgently need attending to

 

smh

 

Read the ruling. It's a very very good ruling from the point of view of our developing constitutional jurisprudence.

 

One of the most frustrating things about Guyana is its uncreative, intellectually stunted approach to the law. They have an extremely literalist approach that prohibits/checks the flowering of our common law tradition.

 

I obviously agree that this case was a self-serving grab for office by Jagdeo but the ruling itself outlines some very important principles of construction which have never before been brought to bear on our constitutional monstrosity.

FM

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