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Originally Posted by Stormborn:
Originally Posted by politikalamity:

I see many talk about how bad a situation the US is in and indeed the gap between the rich and others is widening, you see it. A couple of my suggestions would be:

 

Tax all stocks, options and commodities trades 0.1% per transaction

Tax any annual income over 5,000,000, 50%

Put the money towards education, healthcare and social programs

 

Happy thanks giving all!

Who you think will pay the transaction tax? That is not a way to reshape the income gap. One needs the rich to pay the same proportion as the poor with no exemptions. They manipulate these to their ends and hardly pay taxes.

I don't know how the rich paying taxes correct the growing income gap. The rich paying taxes will allow the government to pay their bills but that doesn't do much for unemployed American. 

FM
Originally Posted by ksazma:
 

The United States is a free market. It does not depend on the government to train or employ its citizens. Government is responsible for matters of national security and current business module is heading into a national security area if it is not there as yet.

This is the problem with the USA. People want private companies to do what the government is supposed to do.

 

1.  It is NOT the responsibility of private companies to guarantee work for Americans. They will hire Americans as they need to, and pay them the MINIMUM that the market will allow.

 

2. If US workers aren't the most productive for a particular aspect of production, then either a machine or a workers located off shore will replace them.

 

3.  Corporations will manage cash as they see fit.  Profits will be highest in the location where taxation is the lowest. They don't have any obligation to guarantee revenues for any govt.

 

 

So if its isn't the responsibility for the US govt to anticipate what the labor force needs, will be, and to ensure that US workers are competitive, it surely is NOT the obligation of global corporations.

FM
Originally Posted by caribny:
Originally Posted by ksazma:
 

The United States is a free market. It does not depend on the government to train or employ its citizens. Government is responsible for matters of national security and current business module is heading into a national security area if it is not there as yet.

This is the problem with the USA. People want private companies to do what the government is supposed to do.

 

1.  It is NOT the responsibility of private companies to guarantee work for Americans. They will hire Americans as they need to, and pay them the MINIMUM that the market will allow.

 

2. If US workers aren't the most productive for a particular aspect of production, then either a machine or a workers located off shore will replace them.

 

3.  Corporations will manage cash as they see fit.  Profits will be highest in the location where taxation is the lowest. They don't have any obligation to guarantee revenues for any govt.

 

 

So if its isn't the responsibility for the US govt to anticipate what the labor force needs, will be, and to ensure that US workers are competitive, it surely is NOT the obligation of global corporations.

How do you see the US government going about achieving this?

FM

From day one this exporting of jobs has been wrong and the only way this can be corrected is by the people. The citizens have to get together, maybe a march (this is done for about every other thing)to show their support against this greed that is hurting everyone but the already rich companies.

The people have to grab the bull by the horns,pay a little bit more for their own products,kicking the foreign made to the curb. I do it as often as I could, I purchase Cdn or US items before any other.

Ok I drive a German car so I gotta add them in

 

These actions will prove worthwhile in no time at all.

 

Something that pisses me off is when these companies receive grants from their Govt then turn around and pull this stunt.

cain
Last edited by cain
Originally Posted by ksazma:
Originally Posted by Stormborn:
Originally Posted by politikalamity:

I see many talk about how bad a situation the US is in and indeed the gap between the rich and others is widening, you see it. A couple of my suggestions would be:

 

Tax all stocks, options and commodities trades 0.1% per transaction

Tax any annual income over 5,000,000, 50%

Put the money towards education, healthcare and social programs

 

Happy thanks giving all!

Who you think will pay the transaction tax? That is not a way to reshape the income gap. One needs the rich to pay the same proportion as the poor with no exemptions. They manipulate these to their ends and hardly pay taxes.

I don't know how the rich paying taxes correct the growing income gap. The rich paying taxes will allow the government to pay their bills but that doesn't do much for unemployed American. 

Taxes is one way...regulations another the theft of 3 trillion in the housing bubble is a consequence of lack of controls on investment banking and the fabrication of financial instruments from thin air.

FM
Originally Posted by Stormborn:
Originally Posted by ksazma:
Originally Posted by Stormborn:
Originally Posted by politikalamity:

I see many talk about how bad a situation the US is in and indeed the gap between the rich and others is widening, you see it. A couple of my suggestions would be:

 

Tax all stocks, options and commodities trades 0.1% per transaction

Tax any annual income over 5,000,000, 50%

Put the money towards education, healthcare and social programs

 

Happy thanks giving all!

Who you think will pay the transaction tax? That is not a way to reshape the income gap. One needs the rich to pay the same proportion as the poor with no exemptions. They manipulate these to their ends and hardly pay taxes.

I don't know how the rich paying taxes correct the growing income gap. The rich paying taxes will allow the government to pay their bills but that doesn't do much for unemployed American. 

Taxes is one way...regulations another the theft of 3 trillion in the housing bubble is a consequence of lack of controls on investment banking and the fabrication of financial instruments from thin air.

Regulation moreso. Deregulation over the past 3 decades has really hurt the working class. Now that AT&T has taken over Directv, you can choose between AT&T or Comcast. Although AT&T has storefronts, you can only talk to them if you wish to buy something. When you call for help, you get people from some other country who most of he time has a language barrier and no authority to resolve anything. Same with Comcast. Because of all this outsourcing, customer service is horrible.

FM
Originally Posted by ksazma:
Originally Posted by Stormborn:
Originally Posted by ksazma:
Originally Posted by Stormborn:
Originally Posted by politikalamity:

I see many talk about how bad a situation the US is in and indeed the gap between the rich and others is widening, you see it. A couple of my suggestions would be:

 

Tax all stocks, options and commodities trades 0.1% per transaction

Tax any annual income over 5,000,000, 50%

Put the money towards education, healthcare and social programs

 

Happy thanks giving all!

Who you think will pay the transaction tax? That is not a way to reshape the income gap. One needs the rich to pay the same proportion as the poor with no exemptions. They manipulate these to their ends and hardly pay taxes.

I don't know how the rich paying taxes correct the growing income gap. The rich paying taxes will allow the government to pay their bills but that doesn't do much for unemployed American. 

Taxes is one way...regulations another the theft of 3 trillion in the housing bubble is a consequence of lack of controls on investment banking and the fabrication of financial instruments from thin air.

Regulation moreso. Deregulation over the past 3 decades has really hurt the working class. Now that AT&T has taken over Directv, you can choose between AT&T or Comcast. Although AT&T has storefronts, you can only talk to them if you wish to buy something. When you call for help, you get people from some other country who most of he time has a language barrier and no authority to resolve anything. Same with Comcast. Because of all this outsourcing, customer service is horrible.

Sounds like Rogers and Bell in Canada.

FM
Originally Posted by ksazma:

Regulation moreso. Deregulation over the past 3 decades has really hurt the working class. Now that AT&T has taken over Directv, you can choose between AT&T or Comcast. Although AT&T has storefronts, you can only talk to them if you wish to buy something. When you call for help, you get people from some other country who most of he time has a language barrier and no authority to resolve anything. Same with Comcast. Because of all this outsourcing, customer service is horrible.

A couple years ago during a wicked snow storm,my telephone line came down, I called Bell and one of Cobra's people dem tried tellin Iman to go with a ladder outside in that deep tarass snow and start wuk on it, hehehehe

 

So here is my question an ah sure you guys askin the same thing

Is like, how the rass she know Iman got a ladder?

cain
Originally Posted by cain:
 

A couple years ago during a wicked snow storm,my telephone line came down, I called Bell and one of Cobra's people dem tried tellin Iman to go with a ladder outside in that deep tarass snow and start wuk on it, hehehehe

 

So here is my question an ah sure you guys askin the same thing

Is like, how the rass she know Iman got a ladder?

Because yuh sounded like yuh was high.

FM
Originally Posted by ksazma:
Originally Posted by cain:
 

A couple years ago during a wicked snow storm,my telephone line came down, I called Bell and one of Cobra's people dem tried tellin Iman to go with a ladder outside in that deep tarass snow and start wuk on it, hehehehe

 

So here is my question an ah sure you guys askin the same thing

Is like, how the rass she know Iman got a ladder?

Because yuh sounded like yuh was high.

Cain probably told the lady to choose between his snake or ladder and the lady chose the ladder.

FM
Originally Posted by yuji22:
Originally Posted by ksazma:
Originally Posted by cain:
 

A couple years ago during a wicked snow storm,my telephone line came down, I called Bell and one of Cobra's people dem tried tellin Iman to go with a ladder outside in that deep tarass snow and start wuk on it, hehehehe

 

So here is my question an ah sure you guys askin the same thing

Is like, how the rass she know Iman got a ladder?

Because yuh sounded like yuh was high.

Cain probably told the lady to choose between his snake or ladder and the lady chose the ladder.

LOL... you did it two laugh's for the day.

Django
Originally Posted by Django:
Originally Posted by yuji22:
Originally Posted by ksazma:
Originally Posted by cain:
 

A couple years ago during a wicked snow storm,my telephone line came down, I called Bell and one of Cobra's people dem tried tellin Iman to go with a ladder outside in that deep tarass snow and start wuk on it, hehehehe

 

So here is my question an ah sure you guys askin the same thing

Is like, how the rass she know Iman got a ladder?

Because yuh sounded like yuh was high.

Cain probably told the lady to choose between his snake or ladder and the lady chose the ladder.

LOL... you did it two laugh's for the day.

Bhai. We need to have some light, non political fun once in a while.

FM
Originally Posted by cain:

From day one this exporting of jobs has been wrong and the only way this can be corrected is by the people. The citizens have to get together, maybe a march (this is done for about every other thing)to show their support against this greed that is hurting everyone but the already rich companies.

 

You must be a hippie to chat such nonsense. 

 

Americans are greedy by nature. Some are better able to satisfy their greedy needs, so cut this nonsense that greed can only be found in the corporate sector.  Look at how many politicians are going to jail.  Look at how much corruption exists within the non profit sector.  The Red Cross gobbling up money meant to help poor people in New Orleans and Haiti.

 

This is a market based free enterprise society, so no one can tell corporations whether to outsource or not. You think some march is going to change minds?

 

If the gov't cannot be bothered to assist people to be more globally competitive, in order to provide incentive for on shoring of off shore jobs, then why should corporations.

 

Folks also need to let go of the notion of entitlement.  Corporations select the people whose skills, mind set and productivity best suits their needs.  Workers select the companies who provide the best pay/benefits, work environment and ability to succeed.  The trick is to find where these points meet.

 

And cut out the notion of manufacturing going back to what it was in the 50s and 60s. NEVER will happen again.  The trade unions chased jobs out of the Mid West and North East to the South.  Then automation and off shore opportunities reduced manufacturing jobs even further.

 

Now that manufacturing jobs are being brought back to the USA they have been heavily automated and/or located in the South where wages are lowest, and there are less rigorous labor force regulations.

 

BOTTOM is in a free market system capital will go where to gets the highest return.  So don't scream about not getting jobs if those opportunities exist elsewhere.  May not be fair, but it is what it is. Note that US corporations began to off shore when Japanese companies under cut their market share in the USA, as they were more efficient.  Now other Asian companies are performing the same role.

FM
Last edited by Former Member
Originally Posted by Stormborn:
Originally Posted by politikalamity:

I see many talk about how bad a situation the US is in and indeed the gap between the rich and others is widening, you see it. A couple of my suggestions would be:

 

Tax all stocks, options and commodities trades 0.1% per transaction

Tax any annual income over 5,000,000, 50%

Put the money towards education, healthcare and social programs

 

Happy thanks giving all!

Who you think will pay the transaction tax? That is not a way to reshape the income gap. One needs the rich to pay the same proportion as the poor with no exemptions. They manipulate these to their ends and hardly pay taxes.

The issue is the super rich derives more and more income from passive sources, which has a favorable tax regime.  They also have a lot of loopholes such as "carried interest", etc to not pay taxes.   The middle and upper middle class bear the brunt of this with all deductions being phased out, most well below 200k and the rest thereafter.  The evolution of how income is derived has changed substantially but the taxing regime and principles have not kept up.

 

In a rare twist, it is Bernie Sanders and Trump who talks the most of this inequity.

FM
Originally Posted by baseman:
Originally Posted by Stormborn:
Originally Posted by politikalamity:

I see many talk about how bad a situation the US is in and indeed the gap between the rich and others is widening, you see it. A couple of my suggestions would be:

 

Tax all stocks, options and commodities trades 0.1% per transaction

Tax any annual income over 5,000,000, 50%

Put the money towards education, healthcare and social programs

 

Happy thanks giving all!

Who you think will pay the transaction tax? That is not a way to reshape the income gap. One needs the rich to pay the same proportion as the poor with no exemptions. They manipulate these to their ends and hardly pay taxes.

The issue is the super rich derives more and more income from passive sources, which has a favorable tax regime.  They also have a lot of loopholes such as "carried interest", etc to not pay taxes.   The middle and upper middle class bear the brunt of this with all deductions being phased out, most well below 200k and the rest thereafter.  The evolution of how income is derived has changed substantially but the taxing regime and principles have not kept up.

 

In a rare twist, it is Bernie Sanders and Trump who talks the most of this inequity.

All of the Bush income tax cuts have been removed, and taxation of capital income the highest since the Clinton era, with additional Medicare taxation for those with higher incomes.

 

What needs to be looked are all those deductions for second homes, yachts, private planes, etc.  In addition to the various assorted corporate loop holes.

 

At the end of the day if folks think that they will achieve income equality through taxation, let them continue. No one is going to allow 90% of their income to be paid in taxes.  Please note that the various global tax havens were quite evident in the pre Reagan era.

 

There are at least 5 Caribbean islands willing to sell citizenship to wealthy Americans who renounce their US citizenship.  Note that these Americans will NOT have to live, or even visit those islands. Just invest money.  They can then buy green cards by investing in US assets, but shelter most of their income by booking it from corporations based overseas.

 

Those nutcases who think that the wealthy will pay more than 50% in taxes need to get a grip.

FM
Originally Posted by ksazma:
Originally Posted by caribny:
 

Those nutcases who think that the wealthy will pay more than 50% in taxes need to get a grip.

Even that does not solve the solve the employment problem in the US.

Iman say the people boycot dem foreign made for a while rass see how we hippies could start make changes.

cain
Originally Posted by ksazma:
Originally Posted by caribny:
 

Those nutcases who think that the wealthy will pay more than 50% in taxes need to get a grip.

Even that does not solve the solve the employment problem in the US.

There will need to be a cocktail of large-scale incentives, tax and otherwise to bring back mid-high tech manufacture in the USA.  We have engineering grads who cannot find work because of outsourcing.  I know one firm in NJ who had 12 design engineers now have two, and business is up.  The work have been outsourced to India and the two here check to make sure the Indians delivered what was asked.  I met a few engineers who had to accept service tech jobs competing with Vocational school grads because service and repair are all that's available.  They are worse off than the Vocational school grads because many have student loans.

 

Marco Rubio said a welder makes more than a Philosopher, true, but they also make more than an engineer.

 

Today few can do with less US workers, deliver the same product/service and make more money.  This is where income disparity stems from!

FM
Last edited by Former Member
Originally Posted by baseman:
 

There will need to be a cocktail of large-scale incentives, tax and otherwise to bring back mid-high tech manufacture in the USA.

 

What large-scale incentive, tax and otherwise will bring back high tech jobs? This is all political mumbo jumbo. No business will give up a dollar to get back 20 cents. A privilege tariff will make them ketch sense because no matter how much they make and how low their cost is, their ultimate goal is to SELL what they make or they have no business. So again, what incentive do you think will correct this?

 

We have engineering grads who cannot find work because of outsourcing.  I know one firm in NJ who had 12 design engineers now have two, and business is up.  The work have been outsourced to India and the two here check to make sure the Indians delivered what was asked.  I met a few engineers who had to accept service tech jobs competing with Vocational school grads because service and repair are all that's available.  They are worse off than the Vocational school grads because many have student loans.

 

I am not addressing labor lost to technology. That is inevitable. It is labor lost to outsourcing that is the problem. There are a lot of labor lost to technology in the banking industry in spite of banks getting richer mostly because of deregulation.

 

Marco Rubio said a welder makes more than a Philosopher, true, but they also make more than an engineer.

 

Actually what Rubio said was that a welder should make more than a Philosopher. My 12 years old son thought that Rubio was crazy to make this comment.   But then again, Rubio is always sadly mistaken.

 

Today few can do with less US workers, deliver the same product/service and make more money.  This is where income disparity stems from!

 

Again, while there are inevitable labor loss to technology, the issue at hand is labor loss to outsourcing. That cannot be corrected without making US businesses have to choose between outsourcing and market share. No amount of tax will fix this because you cannot tax more than 100% and anything less than 100% still makes it profitable to outsource.

 

Lastly, we Americans trying to keep free trade pure is hurting us. Other countries aren't playing by the same rule. China is the worse offender. The US professional basketball team entered the Olympics in 1992 to a resounding gold medal victory. Prior to that we were sending amateurs because our ideals dictate that we should. However, other countries not playing by the same rules were sending professional athletes. Notice how the medal count pattern changed when the US operate as others do. Nice guys finish last.

 

FM
Last edited by Former Member
Originally Posted by ksazma:
Originally Posted by baseman:
 

There will need to be a cocktail of large-scale incentives, tax and otherwise to bring back mid-high tech manufacture in the USA.

 

What large-scale incentive, tax and otherwise will bring back high tech jobs? This is all political mumbo jumbo. No business will give up a dollar to get back 20 cents. A privilege tariff will make them ketch sense because no matter how much they make and how low their cost is, their ultimate goal is to SELL what they make or they have no business. So again, what incentive do you think will correct this?

 

 

 

And when other countries retaliate by placing punitive tariffs on US imports, or US consumers scream when they see their cost of living soar as US companies cease to be competitive, and buy product made in other countries.

 

Not going to work.

FM
Last edited by Former Member

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