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FM
Former Member

Churches can lead the way in racial and national unity

MARCH 30, 2015 | BY  | FILED UNDER LETTERS 

Dear Editor,
In the Will Smith movie, “The Pursuit of Happiness,” Will’s son in the movie told the story: There was a man who was drowning, and a boat came, and the man on the boat said, “Do you need help?” and the drowning man said “No, God will save me.”
Then another boat came and he tried to help him, but he said “No, God will save me,” then he drowned and went to Heaven.
Then the man asked God, “God, why didn’t you save me?” and God said, “I sent you two boats, you dummy!”
In 2011, Guyana entered into a political impasse.  The government became a minority government and instead of getting the message of the electorate that the electorate wants the parties to work together, the government in power for 23 years, continued with more of the same.
Every new day revealed a new scandal, secret deal, or episodes of the “Fleecing of Guyana.” Instead of listening, the government’s counteroffensive accused the APNU and AFC of “obstructing” progress. The combined opposition said it’s not against progress, it’s against scams, secret deals and lack of accountability, and that it would not support projects until there is full disclosure.
The Opposition won credibility by exposing the Amalia scams, the Surendra scams, the fiber optic problems, the Marriott scams, the Skeldon factory scams, and problems in the laptop program.  It was clear the Opposition was looking out for the interests of Guyana and not simply wanting to stop development. That’s the accountability we want as a poor nation.
Many in our churches have prayed for Guyana for decades that our country will move forward as one people, one nation, and one destiny. Since democracy was restored in 1992, despite some progress, we have not entered into the fullness of our blessings. Our people still flee to tiny Caribbean islands with virtually no natural resources eking out a living.
To those of you who have been praying, God has sent us two ships – The APNU and the AFC.  They are sailing as one Coalition force. Please do not let Guyana die. In the life of nations, there are critical moments, and in Guyana, this is one such moment. Never before have we had two parties willing to risk so much in forming a Coalition so that Guyana can move forward as a nation.
We are at a tipping point. All the churches in Guyana need to seize this moment in time and take a position.  Now is not the time for pseudo neutrality.  I call on all churches – all the historic churches, the Lifespring Ministries, the Assembly of God, the Full Gospel Fellowship, and other Pentecostal and evangelical churches to hold national unity prayer meetings and consider Guyana’s future. I also invite our brothers and sisters in the temples and mosques to do the same.
As religious people of faith, we are driven by values of love and forgiveness.  We do not hold anger, envy and bitterness in our hearts, or else we will never heal. We do not drive by looking in the rear view mirror all the time; we look forward in faith, and hope.
Forgetting those things which are behind, we press towards the mark of something new, something better and different. We are led by our faith, not by our fears. In 1992, we were ready for a change, and the mood of the nation in 2015 is the same. Let’s pray and work for change. Guyana’s salvation is at hand. The people in the churches can lead the way in racial and national unity.
Dr. Jerry Jailall

Replies sorted oldest to newest

I agree!

 

 

 

"The Opposition won credibility by exposing the Amalia scams, the Surendra scams, the fiber optic problems, the Marriott scams, the Skeldon factory scams, and problems in the laptop program.  It was clear the Opposition was looking out for the interests of Guyana and not simply wanting to stop development. That’s the accountability we want as a poor nation."

cain
Originally Posted by cain:

I agree!

 

 

 

"The Opposition won credibility by exposing the Amalia scams, the Surendra scams, the fiber optic problems, the Marriott scams, the Skeldon factory scams, and problems in the laptop program.  It was clear the Opposition was looking out for the interests of Guyana and not simply wanting to stop development. That’s the accountability we want as a poor nation."

Bharriott scams. [According to Moses]

FM

I agree that churches can make a big difference.  Many are multiracial and they can buy into the APNU-AFC coalition but somebody has got to work them.

 

We can't have 5 more years of these reverse Robin Hoods stealing from the poor and giving to the rich.

FM

You want Guyana to be run like the countries like in the middle east? Which religion will dominate the government? Please, keep religion out of politics. Guyana has enough problems already

FM
Originally Posted by skeldon_man:

You want Guyana to be run like the countries like in the middle east? Which religion will dominate the government? Please, keep religion out of politics. Guyana has enough problems already

Skelly

 

I agree. Religion should be separate from the state. 

FM
Originally Posted by yuji22:
Originally Posted by skeldon_man:

You want Guyana to be run like the countries like in the middle east? Which religion will dominate the government? Please, keep religion out of politics. Guyana has enough problems already

Skelly

 

I agree. Religion should be separate from the state. 

Some of these hogballs write their nonsense without thinking about how big the can and what kind of worms in the can they are trying to open up. Thank god he is not running Guyana or planning to run for office one day...I hope.

FM
Originally Posted by skeldon_man:
Originally Posted by yuji22:
Originally Posted by skeldon_man:

You want Guyana to be run like the countries like in the middle east? Which religion will dominate the government? Please, keep religion out of politics. Guyana has enough problems already

Skelly

 

I agree. Religion should be separate from the state. 

Some of these hogballs write their nonsense without thinking about how big the can and what kind of worms in the can they are trying to open up. Thank god he is not running Guyana or planning to run for office one day...I hope.

Skelly

 

With the exception of Gil and a few others from the PNC camp on GNI, the rest display their ignorance by their personally attacking those who differ from their opinion politically, they also post misinformation and nonsense on a daily basis.

 

Please forgive their ignorance.

FM
Originally Posted by skeldon_man:

You want Guyana to be run like the countries like in the middle east? Which religion will dominate the government? Please, keep religion out of politics. Guyana has enough problems already

In the US, Churches and old folks homes are a sure bet. They are the first canvassed and they remain on the radar for the duration. It is one of the reasons Ministers has so much clout. In the old days, Ministers would be given walk around money to help canvass and apprise their congregation of the party the minister supports. It is what makes the southern baptists so strong and the reason the tea party has so much clout,  Christians.

FM
Originally Posted by yuji22:
Originally Posted by skeldon_man:

You want Guyana to be run like the countries like in the middle east? Which religion will dominate the government? Please, keep religion out of politics. Guyana has enough problems already

Skelly

 

I agree. Religion should be separate from the state. 

The separation clause prohibits congress from making rules with respect to religion not that religious people cannot organize to install a congressman or senator of their choice.

FM
Originally Posted by yuji22:
Originally Posted by skeldon_man:

You want Guyana to be run like the countries like in the middle east? Which religion will dominate the government? Please, keep religion out of politics. Guyana has enough problems already

Skelly

 

I agree. Religion should be separate from the state. 

Tell Dharmic Sabha and CIOG dat........also dat fake bishop emmanuel grimes aka Juan de turd.

FM

The Catholic Church was also very instrumental in the fight against the Burnham government. Father Morrison and the Catholic Standard were on the frontlines of the fight while the PPP were hugging up with Burnham. They even tried to assassinate Fr. Morrison but mistakenly got Fr. Darke instead. 

Mars
Originally Posted by Mars:

The Catholic Church was also very instrumental in the fight against the Burnham government. Father Morrison and the Catholic Standard were on the frontlines of the fight while the PPP were hugging up with Burnham. They even tried to assassinate Fr. Morrison but mistakenly got Fr. Darke instead. 

Yeah, they removed Burnham and Hoyte in succession.

FM
Originally Posted by skeldon_man:

You want Guyana to be run like the countries like in the middle east? Which religion will dominate the government? Please, keep religion out of politics. Guyana has enough problems already

Dr Jailall is a long time member here. He is very much involved in his community here in the US. I think he is presently in NC. Churches are always in politics. In Latin  America, the strongest movement of the last century was liberation theology. It ones welfare is a matter for the church. It saves souls but also ensure lives are seen to worth something. The ways to salvation is not mere theological but sociological. Hungry people do not make god centered people. Practicing ones faith means practicing good methodology to governing.  It was socialized religion. Some called it christian Marxism.

FM
Originally Posted by skeldon_man:
Originally Posted by Mars:

The Catholic Church was also very instrumental in the fight against the Burnham government. Father Morrison and the Catholic Standard were on the frontlines of the fight while the PPP were hugging up with Burnham. They even tried to assassinate Fr. Morrison but mistakenly got Fr. Darke instead. 

Yeah, they removed Burnham and Hoyte in succession.

The church could not do it alone with only the WPA alongside them against the PNC and PPP giving them critical support. They gave it a good fight though, unlike the PPP who were either kissing up Odo or hiding under their beds.

Mars
Originally Posted by Mars:
Originally Posted by skeldon_man:
Originally Posted by Mars:

The Catholic Church was also very instrumental in the fight against the Burnham government. Father Morrison and the Catholic Standard were on the frontlines of the fight while the PPP were hugging up with Burnham. They even tried to assassinate Fr. Morrison but mistakenly got Fr. Darke instead. 

Yeah, they removed Burnham and Hoyte in succession.

The church could not do it alone with only the WPA alongside them against the PNC and PPP giving them critical support. They gave it a good fight though, unlike the PPP who were either kissing up Odo or hiding under their beds.

You are right. THe catholic church were always in the trenches against communism of any shape. They opposed Cheddi ad then Burnham. Their struggle was the most significant struggle to remove him from office. Note They were at the heart of the student revolt which extended from 76 to 79. Religious teachers were at the heart of the movement.

FM

The point seems to be that many Christian churches are multiracial and they may more respond to the message of the Coalition that seeks national unity.

 

The PPP does not have national unity as a big plank of their platform.  They simply want to win back parliament so there is no impediment to them doing what they want. This is not about PPP wanting to do anything for the working stiff.

 

I don't think the article is asking of the establishment of any particular religion.  Churches can encourage members to go out and vote, and pray for national unity. If national unity is important, that will cause you to lean towards the coalition.

FM

I don't know what you people think is so magical about Christianity that transcends Guyana's political race issue.

 

Guyanese churches may have Indian and Black members and they do indeed get along like Indians and Blacks almost everywhere else but people still hold onto their racial stereotypes with a "well, these aren't your average (insert the word Blacks or Indians). These people are different." Even interracial relationships don't seem to wash people free of prejudicial notions of their spouse's race. Their spouse is always the "exception."

 

This may seem counter-intuitive but Guyana does not have a "real" race problem per se. Blacks and Indians do not fundamentally dislike each other. Even Nehru himself does not fundamentally hate Black people. We have a problem of how power is distributed in an all powerful State, spoils awarded etc. etc. When you have parties of little men organized around a particular race and that race wins, these people will reward themselves to the detriment of the losing party peopled by the other race.

 

Evidence the PPP and their Ambassadors. Of course their Ambassadors are Indian. Ambassadors are usually trusted friends of the President. Ambassadorships are usually plums for the ruling party's supporters. Ambassadorships are usually rewards for long serving party stalwarts of the ruling party. When the Coalition wins, I expect most of the Ambassadors to be Black not because the Coalition's principal party the PNC is anti-Indian but because it's gonna have to reward it's principal supporters/donors/stalwarts who are most likely Black. And to the untrained simplistic eye, this will look like racial vengeance.

FM

Evidence the PPP and their Ambassadors. Of course their Ambassadors are Indian. Ambassadors are usually trusted friends of the President. Ambassadorships are usually plums for the ruling party's supporters. Ambassadorships are usually rewards for long serving party stalwarts of the ruling party. When the Coalition wins, I expect most of the Ambassadors to be Black not because the Coalition's principal party the PNC is anti-Indian but because it's gonna have to reward it's principal supporters/donors/stalwarts who are most likely Black. And to the untrained simplistic eye, this will look like racial vengeance.

 

This is a very good point. That most of the Ambassadors were Indians was not some kind of racism. Most of the embassies are Afro dominated - the first secretary, 2nd secretary, staff, etc.  Diplomatic appointments are rewards for loyalty, support, campaign contributions.  The PPP's problem was it gave jobs to so-called civics that should have gone to people who were there when the party needed them most.  People such as Hydar Ally was a Jagan loyalist but never became a Minister.  Ramotar never became a Minister or Ambassador. And there were many like him.  Some were lucky to get ambassadorships.

FM
Originally Posted by yuji22:
Originally Posted by skeldon_man:

You want Guyana to be run like the countries like in the middle east? Which religion will dominate the government? Please, keep religion out of politics. Guyana has enough problems already

Skelly

 

I agree. Religion should be separate from the state. 

The churches are made up of people

People are voters

Voters vote

Churches are supposed to be on the side of righteousness

Churches obviously have to despise the PPP

The people in the churches who vote should be voting against their despicable government.

cain
Originally Posted by Vish M:

I guess every vote counts.

 

Time to scrap the barrel

 

"Let's raid the churches of VOTERS"

 

Desperation Time 

 

Well, it's kinda like looking for a wife as an American citizen. Easier to scrape the rural villages of some Third World country for some girl easily attracted to the prospect of a green cyard

 

Some might call that "desperation"

FM
Originally Posted by Shaitaan:

I don't know what you people think is so magical about Christianity that transcends Guyana's political race issue.

 

Guyanese churches may have Indian and Black members and they do indeed get along like Indians and Blacks almost everywhere else but people still hold onto their racial stereotypes with a "well, these aren't your average (insert the word Blacks or Indians). These people are different." Even interracial relationships don't seem to wash people free of prejudicial notions of their spouse's race. Their spouse is always the "exception."

 

This may seem counter-intuitive but Guyana does not have a "real" race problem per se. Blacks and Indians do not fundamentally dislike each other. Even Nehru himself does not fundamentally hate Black people. We have a problem of how power is distributed in an all powerful State, spoils awarded etc. etc. When you have parties of little men organized around a particular race and that race wins, these people will reward themselves to the detriment of the losing party peopled by the other race.

 

Evidence the PPP and their Ambassadors. Of course their Ambassadors are Indian. Ambassadors are usually trusted friends of the President. Ambassadorships are usually plums for the ruling party's supporters. Ambassadorships are usually rewards for long serving party stalwarts of the ruling party. When the Coalition wins, I expect most of the Ambassadors to be Black not because the Coalition's principal party the PNC is anti-Indian but because it's gonna have to reward it's principal supporters/donors/stalwarts who are most likely Black. And to the untrained simplistic eye, this will look like racial vengeance.

Where did anyone suggest Christianity transcend race or not? I am more inclined to think Christians like Muslims are less race conscious and more god conscious. Some 25 Percent of Indians are Christians and another 12 to 14 are Muslims. Most Indians in Guyana are also Hindus by designation as they do not practice any rigid orthodoxy. Our racial balkanization is also only on the political level as on the social level some one fifth of the population have one parent in the other race. We are and will grow out of our prejudices like Jamaica and Trinidad to some extent.

 

 

FM
Originally Posted by Shaitaan:
Originally Posted by Vish M:

I guess every vote counts.

 

Time to scrap the barrel

 

"Let's raid the churches of VOTERS"

 

Desperation Time 

 

Well, it's kinda like looking for a wife as an American citizen. Easier to scrape the rural villages of some Third World country for some girl easily attracted to the prospect of a green cyard

 

Some might call that "desperation"

Sometimes you write pure bunk. A congregation is a community and more easily convinced of a political view if the leader of the congregation is a message maker for the view. Much of American politics is church based. It is why NC and SC with large black populations are practically the most conservative places in the nation. Conservatism is a church based movement. When your stupid cousin or Ugli say they are conservatives they should know it is Christ grounded because it is christian centered. Similarly, one cannot go into a black community and try to organize without starting with the pastors. All the local movers and shakers are church centered. It is not trolling for votes. It is grounded one's message in the community. I am sure that the Churches and Mandirs and Mosques are centers of political idea formation.

FM

I like how Cain and Storm explain it.

 

Most ordinary people go to Church.  In many communities, the Church is the heart of the community, and is the social organizer.

 

Church people can buy into "national unity" better because they hear similar religious messages.

 

It was good that Granger preached at the large Lifespring Ministries in Chateau Margot. That Church is mixed and the Pastor is quite influential and charismatic. They need to do more of that.

FM
Originally Posted by Stormborn:
Originally Posted by Shaitaan:
Originally Posted by Vish M:

I guess every vote counts.

 

Time to scrap the barrel

 

"Let's raid the churches of VOTERS"

 

Desperation Time 

 

Well, it's kinda like looking for a wife as an American citizen. Easier to scrape the rural villages of some Third World country for some girl easily attracted to the prospect of a green cyard

 

Some might call that "desperation"

Sometimes you write pure bunk. A congregation is a community and more easily convinced of a political view if the leader of the congregation is a message maker for the view. Much of American politics is church based. It is why NC and SC with large black populations are practically the most conservative places in the nation. Conservatism is a church based movement. When your stupid cousin or Ugli say they are conservatives they should know it is Christ grounded because it is christian centered. Similarly, one cannot go into a black community and try to organize without starting with the pastors. All the local movers and shakers are church centered. It is not trolling for votes. It is grounded one's message in the community. I am sure that the Churches and Mandirs and Mosques are centers of political idea formation.

 

You spend your time around AI too much. So much so you're starting to think like a machine.

 

FYI, this was a cheap dig at Salty. He knows what I mean. It seems I was a little too subtle for the rest of the Board.

FM

"All the local movers and shakers are church centered."

 

So we have to engage with them.  Simply praying for "National Unity" is an endorsement without having to say, "Vote for the Coalition."

FM
Originally Posted by Stormborn:
Originally Posted by Shaitaan:
Originally Posted by Vish M:

I guess every vote counts.

 

Time to scrap the barrel

 

"Let's raid the churches of VOTERS"

 

Desperation Time 

 

Well, it's kinda like looking for a wife as an American citizen. Easier to scrape the rural villages of some Third World country for some girl easily attracted to the prospect of a green cyard

 

Some might call that "desperation"

Sometimes you write pure bunk. A congregation is a community and more easily convinced of a political view if the leader of the congregation is a message maker for the view. Much of American politics is church based. It is why NC and SC with large black populations are practically the most conservative places in the nation. Conservatism is a church based movement. When your stupid cousin or Ugli say they are conservatives they should know it is Christ grounded because it is christian centered. Similarly, one cannot go into a black community and try to organize without starting with the pastors. All the local movers and shakers are church centered. It is not trolling for votes. It is grounded one's message in the community. I am sure that the Churches and Mandirs and Mosques are centers of political idea formation.

I read Shaitaain's post and was awaiting more juicy stuff.

cain
Originally Posted by Jay Bharrat:

"All the local movers and shakers are church centered."

 

So we have to engage with them.  Simply praying for "National Unity" is an endorsement without having to say, "Vote for the Coalition."

Jay Bharrat, it's quite clear that u actually have no idea what being a Christian means

 

if i were religious, i would be 1st in line calling down fire & brimstone pan your evil, bigot ass

FM

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